The Richie Sambora & Orianthi album

Jackie, I have two instant issues with your post...

1. You stated 2 albums in 3 years but you forgot about Sons Of Beaches so that would make 3 in 3... (I know that was initially stated but it was corrected in another post further down... If you want to talk like an expect, you need to provide the facts like one). And I think most fans are in agreement that although we don't know the exact terms of the contract, educated evidence gives us a pretty good idea. Enough to disprove your winy opinions...

2. You say "they rushed in the studio" but lets break this down a little. The Circle came out in 2009 and WAN came out in 2013 - that's 4 years between studio albums. You are so hellbent on this long break but it was also pointed out to you that WAN would have most likely been released around the same time regardless.

They had a year and a half off between tours (and the release of WAN - remember it came out after the tour started)... They could have taken off a solid year and then worked on the album after the fact... But Jon had some songs and wanted to lay them down so instead they took 6 months off, worked on the album for 6 months, and then took another 6 months off before starting the tour...

I don't see anything wrong here. Studio Album in 2009, GH in 2010, Studio Album in 2013. Long breaks between albums, Long Breaks between Tours, and even long breaks between each leg of the tours.

The rest of your post is just stuff we've all discussed a million times...

All I can offer and say about WAN is, it's evident that Jon and John worked on the majority of the album. Richie only co-wrote 5 of the songs. I don't think he was strapped down to anymore time then just a couple of months.

The GHs tour ended July 31st 2011 and the WAN tour stared in February 2013. That's a decent amount of time and within that window, Richie had to sacrifice some minimal time to work on WAN - my guess is just 2 to 3 months...

Just so you won't be afraid to continue, please understand that I'm not mad at all. As I said everyone's entitled to his or her own opinion. I'm just clearing up a few bad assumptions and misperceptions.

And btw, I don't pretend to be an expert. But I didn't change the number of albums because I was quoting you and I didn't want to monkey around with your post, even if it was later corrected, since it didn't really change much.


RDK, the only time I "blow smoke" is when I have a cigarette in my hand.

I don’t throw pity parties. To my knowledge I’ve never victimized Richie and (since the two usually go together) I haven’t villainized Jon. And I'm damn certain I've never referred to Richie as "poor Richie".

I didn’t imply that Richie was overworked. Richie said he needed a break. And he wasn’t the only one. So did Jon. At the first Runaway event after the tour Jon confirmed that, “They all told me it was too soon.” Tico said it needed to be at least a couple years. See previous post.


It appears you misconstrued my comment that the break was cut short and Richie told Jon he needed a break to mean that I think Richie was overworked. Never crossed my mind. He could have slept 24/7 and it wouldn’t change the fact that the break was cut short. Neither does the fact that while he was off he worked on AOTL.


Fact is: neither of them took 2012 off. Richie didn’t have the 6 months you tried to prove, much less a year. It actually looks like the most uninterrupted time they had was possibly Aug-Sept 2011. Your summary has some inaccuracies about who was doing what and when. Here’s Shanks’ version.


"With this record, Jon [Bon Jovi] really wanted to take his time writing, so we took eight months on and off to write the album,” explains John Shanks. "The entire making, including recording, took about a year, starting in October 2011…The songs Jon and I, sometimes with Richie [Sambora], wrote for the album were often written at Jon's apartment or at my home studio, with one or two guitars and a piano, a legal pad, and us recording things into a cassette player or an iPhone. We'd sit together and really hone the lyrics as well as the music…
http://www.soundonsound.com/people/i...what-about-now

Shanks said the album took about a year, starting in Oct 2011. Note that when he says, “The songs Jon and I, sometimes with Richie, wrote for the album…”, he doesn’t say when Richie is or is not involved, so how do YOU know? Other than he only co-wrote 5 of the 12. I’m afraid that doesn’t help much.

From Shanks, it looks like Richie, as co-producer, was involved, more or less, throughout the project from Oct 2011 – at least Oct 2012. I say “at least” because Richie tweeted on 1/18/13 that he was “in the studio for a bit”. Since AOTL was on the shelves by then, I assume it was for more work on WAN.


Based on the above and on tweets, JT posts, articles, etc., here’s my version of the timeline, with a few comments to start.

From tweets, I remember Richie worked with Jon, flying back and forth between CA and NJ sometimes twice a week, as early as Feb 2012, maybe before, writing and later working in the studio. I don't have the tweets handy; but I'll research it, if you'd like.

A promo for CBS Person to Person, with Jon singing "What About Now?" was uploaded on YT on 2/9/12. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=Pt2ln6yk80E From Shanks, I think it’s probable Richie was involved in the recording of the song.

In Feb 2012, Richie was in NYC writing with Jon and Big & Rich

A JT post from 3/2/12 confirms they were working with Des no later than then, and indicates Richie had already been working with Jon before. I deleted it but I’ll look it up if you think it’s more “smoke.”

So here ya go:

2011: October – began work on WAN, per Shanks

2012:

Feb - WAN recording for video in CBS Person to Person promo uploaded to YouTube so the recording was apparently done before then; writing/preproduction of WAN (the album)

Mar 2012 – Worked with Jon and Des

May 20, 2012 – Bamboozle

July 7, 2012 – Greenbrier
July 9, 2012 – Quebec

September 21, 2012 – I-Heart

November 26, 2012 – Travel to NYC
November 27, 2012 – Inside Out event
November 28, 2012 – WAN Photo Shoot
November 30, 2012 – gig with the boys (BJ)

December 11, 2012 – Travel for 12-12-12 concert
December 12, 2012 – 12-12-12 Concert

January 18, 2013 – in the studio; since AOTL was done, I assume this is for WAN
January 22, 2013 – flight to London
January 24, 2013 – BBC performance
January 26, 2013 - Stuttgart
January 29, 2013 – BWC video released (4 vid series – had to be filmed at some time, right??)

February 3, 2013 – Flight East to begin tour

Now that’s based on just a quick glance through TweetTunnel and random information. If you want me to really clear “the smoke” give me a few days to do some real research and I can probably do away with April, August, and October, to prove to you that Richie did NOT take 2012 off. He’s lucky if he had Aug and Sept of 2011.

And that block of time you mentioned during which Richie didn’t have anything to do from Aug 2012 to Feb2013 just went to hell in a handbasket, too.

And btw, Shanks also mentioned that as the production progressed, once Rothschild got involved “he was sending Jon, Richie and I mixes via email. We'd send him notes, and he'd apply those to the mixes. So even though the three of us weren't together for most of the mixing stage, it was a collaborative process.” It’s in the article. Look it up if you want confirmation. So even when Richie wasn’t physically on site, he was still working on WAN.

That’s not me saying me saying “poor Richie” either, just so you know. As you said, he knows the deal. Goes with the territory.

Oh, and btw, none of this information refers to AOTL. It’s all Jovi.

So, is there any other smoke I can clear up for you?

Jon & Shakes writing songs that turned into tracks for WAN has NOTHING to do with Richie...

The CBS Special of Jon only singing WAN in the studio has NOTHING to do with Richie. He's singing What About Now which is a song that Richie had zero involvement writing.

I said the bulk of Richie's involvement happened during February & March... I'd even be generous and bring it out to May... You quoted Shakes saying that "The songs Jon and I wrote, sometimes with Richie"

There are 9 songs on WAN (including the 2 bonus tracks) that Richie had zero involvement with. Of the 5 tracks that he cowrote, none were just Jon and Richie. Desmond, Shanks, & Falcon were all involved... Something tells me that Richie got a credit for minimal involvement.

There is a bulk of time where they work on the album and then tweaking gets done periodically. If Richie said that he was in the studio one day here and there, he was probably laying down some filler tracks and was out in a day.

You also keep bring up that Bamboozled show but that was just one show they did. Okay they did 5 spot shows in the year and half they were off... So What!!!! They are musicians in a rock band and I'm sure Richie got a nice pay check for it.

I believe that the entire process from start to end took a year. Yes, Jon wrote songs with Shanks that turned into tracks for WAN... Yes, Shanks takes the tracks back to CA and works on them with Jon overseeing the process.

Give me a real Richie time-Line, not some CBS Special of only Jon singing WAN in the studio.

Noted and addressed.

Which whiny opinions would those be? I'm not in disagreement with what you guys said, just saying I'm not buying it as the reason that you used to justify Jon cutting the break short (or that's what it seemed to me you were trying to do anyway). Is that not what you were implying when you said that it's a business and it was time to go back to work? Because there was a deadline indicated by 2015 BB?

It just makes sense that Jon would have known all that before all the talk about a hiatus and side projects. I don't see how that was a reason for him to cut the break short (which is what I meant by "rushing" back into the studio).
That is, unless his solo project didn't work out and he needed to hurry up and substitute something, as I said at the end of the post.

Not me, man. Talk to the CEO and the drummer. They're the ones who said two years, or a few years. Please tell me you really didn't read the rest of the post because you're scared of a little girl.



Which you apparently couldn't be bothered to read again or you wouldn't keep making the same errors in assumption; and repeating the same patronizing and off-base comments. Come back when you decide to actually pay attention to the conversation. If that's too much trouble or you're just not interested, that's fine. But please don't act like I'm stupid because you are choosing live in your own alternative universe.

Well, all I can say about that is according to documented information, your guess would be wrong.

And quite frankly, I'm done trying to explain the reasons why.

But for future reference, I'd really prefer it if you wouldn't assume that I'm talking out of my ass, just because you choose to continue talking out of yours. If you want to call me out for the things I say, that's fine. I can't stop you. But at least do me the courtesy of bringing your own verifiable facts, if you're not going to even bother reading mine. Don't try to take me on with half-baked theories and invalid assusmptions.

In the meantime, as the man said, "You write your truth and I'll write mine."

Have a good evening, RDK.

You can think and believe what you choose to, it doesn't make it a fact. This could be true, but nothing has been said to back it up. Everything JBJ and Shanks have said regarding Burning Bridges points to the songs being part of new recording sessions, some from the vault, some from new writing sessions. If John Shanks is a liar or what purpose he would have in lying about when certain songs were recorded that's just assumptions and hearsay....

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

You apparently didn't read my last response before posting this one...

I'm not saying that Jon didn't cut the break short by 6 months as initially stated but it wasn't enough to warrant Richie leaving the band...

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

Nope. I already did that and you're so focused on the 5 songs that Richie co-wrote that you'd refuse to see his other involvement anyway. Who do you think played the guitars and co-produced that recording of WAN that Jon's singing? I know that Wiki is not the definitive last word, but it's close enough for now.

"All tracks produced by John Shanks. Co-produced by Jon Bon Jovi and Richie Sambora."

Go back and read the damn article, RDK.

It's not that important. It was years ago and it's beside the point, anyway. Face it, this all started because you wanted to try and prove that I was making a big deal of something that you didn't think merited it; or that's the way it looked to me, at any rate. So you implied that I was over-simplifying the situation and didn't know what the hell I was talking about. Your opening shot, after insulting my intelligence by "reminding" me that BJM is a business and there were others to consider besides Richie (and Jon), was to say, initially, as if it made a tinker's damn, that Richie had a year off. He didn't. It's that simple.

When you figured out that I'd call you on that, you changed it to six months. I just showed you that he had two months, max, of uninterrupted time off, which is what real "time off" is. No emails to evaluate and comment on mixes, no one-offs, no promos, nada. And the timeline I've already given you proved that.

I've given you the tools and done the math. If you are really interested (and not just still trying to prove that I don't know what I'm talking about or I'm just blowing smoke) you can figure it out.

So because Jon and Richie did a 12 12 12 show for Sandy or a few other shows due to commitments, this is considered 'interrupted time off' and warrants poor Richie's burnout????

You wanted Jon and Richie to go in separate directions and have zero involvement for two years???

Let me explain something sweetheart, that would NEVER happen in a million years if Richie was stilled tied to Bon Jovi... Even during their solo runs between These Days and Crush, they performed together at events and with the band...

There is no way they could have zero involvement with each other for an extended period of time...

You live in a fairly tail land of black and white and the real world, the business world, doesn't work like that...

If Richie's in Hawaii for a month and has to fly out to do a show and then fly back, I really don't consider that not having time off...

There are 2 realistic factors involved with 'Time Off'...

1 is touring - which they did not do for a year an a half...

And the other is Album Making however based on my research, this was a solo album tuned into a band album... and Richie's involvement was minimal... His name was throw into those credits to add some weight into it all... Believe what you want to believe but I live in reality, not fantacy like yourself...

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

Are there any other bands (you know, old bands) that still do this nowadays?
Release albums every 2 years and go tour the world in that frequency?

Can't Jon made these tours smaller? Release the damn album, but the tour shouldn't tire all the band members to death. Less dates, doesn't need to go every ****ing corner of the world every damn tour.
Tico is 62 ffs. David's got his musical stuff, maybe Richie would still be in the band idk.

I don't know about you but I've been seeing these guys having a grand old time for the past two and a half years all over social media... I think Dave went on 5 vacations...

Besides the one month Burning Bridges Tour, these guys been having the time of their life... I wouldn't doubt if their involvement with this new album doesn't extend a week or so... At this point it's the Jon / John show... He probably just need the guys for touring now...

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk