So you've ripped it.............

Agree with most of what you posted here.

To me, a blind fan is someone who sees nothing but positive in something. That they're so blinded by their fandom that they can see no wrong in what their idol does. That certainly isn't me as a quick search of some of my posts will show and I don't think it's you either.

Look, I was a Bryan Adams fan. Like some of his older stuff. However, I don't like his new stuff. I don't think it's worse than something I think is bad (which Panda has already admitted he does in terms of WAN) but if I did, I wouldn't go posting on a Bryan Adams message board. That's a waste of time to me and just a negative thing to do. Ditto with U2 and Oasis towards the end of their run. I don't understand that mentality.

Either way, if Panda wants to run Bon Jovi down 24 hours a day on a this board, then that's up to him. I think that's a waste of his time but it's his time to waste and it's my opinion to have that he's wasting his time. I never did, or never would, tell him not to post here. That's just another poster spinning stuff because he stuck his nose in and bit off more than he can chew.

There is a difference between loving everything and accepting everything for what it is. I look at the big picture. 30 years is a long time and a ton of music if you throw in solos, box sets, B-sides, covers, compilations, etc....

The number is well over 400, close to 500 songs. Do I love every single one of them? Absolutely not. But I can say I love a certain percentage of them and that is enough for me to continue as a die-hard fan.

Is a song like "Do It To Ya" going to change my opinion of the band? No because I accept it for what it is. Is it in my collection, yes! As a fan I like to go back and re-listen to songs like this because there are certain things I didn't notice at the time that are clearer now because of the changed time/band. Also as a fan, I collect all Bon Jovi music. However this song is not a fraction of what this band has done.

This new album is actually pretty good. The more and more you listen to it, the more and more I'm really digging it. There are some great ones on here, there are some good ones on here, and there are some ones on here I accept.

Pretty much agree with that. There are a bunch of Bon Jovi songs that I think are garbage. I'd guess most are since 2000 so I can see a decline but I know that the trend is the same with most artists and most people in their careers.

There is enough to keep me coming back. There is enough to make me get any Bon Jovi song I can. Not because I'll like them all. For instance, I hated These Days originally. I got into the band with Always and Crossroad and expected the big choruses and anthems. When I first played These Days I thought "What the **** is this rubbish". Within months it was my favourite album of all time and remains that today.

Then there are songs like Complicated, Everyday, WGIGO or Live Before I Die that I hated on first listen and hate even more now. Still glad I have them in the collection though.

As expected the album is as bad as, if not worse than, The Circle. I don't care what a bunch of fanboys claim, I don't need to listen to crap more than once, and this album sounded like crap. If you listen to anything enough times, you'll like it eventually. So we should all just listen to it to death ntil we're hardcore die-hard fans of the crap Bon Jovi has released. I didn't buy the last one, I won't buy this one either.

Ok, sports. So when a team fails to deliver, theres often change in personnel. Used-up has-beens never tend to carry any team, so they are replaced. Is that what you would want from BJ as well? Guys seem to have lost their ability to write and perform kick-ass anthems, let's have them replaced. As long as name remains. Supporting teams, well. You support the team, not a single member. Everyone is replaceable. As long as it works for the team. To make it short, you just can't compare sport and music.


New album then.
Good? I disagree. This is strictly opinion related though.

Bon Jovi sound? No. Not at all. It's Shanks-sound. Nothing too posivite about it. Watered down, playing it safe to please certain masses.

Bon Jovi lyrics? No. Trying to be relevant, which actually is not typical, or even working.

Longevity? I'd call it stubborn. Staying true? Well, staying true to attempts to be on the day & maximizing profit. Doing so, creativity is sacrificed.

Character, again. Indeed. Joviland needs character instead of asskissing. So people, be true to yourselves, show some character and admit that new products is failure.

I've always said I love Bon Jovi like I love my football team in the UK. No matter how shit they are I will always support them through thick and thin

You’re talking about 2 different things here.

1. When a team fails to deliver, they do not necessarily get rid of players, especially ones with contracts. They replace the managers which in this scenario would be considered the producer.

2. As far as players getting too old to perform. True, but a rock star has a longer career longevity. If players retire at 40, they stop having perfect years at 35 however they are still very effective especially in clutch situations. Bon Jovi are at that 35 year point.


But regardless of the above, you are missing the overall point so I'll spell it out for you. It's not about comparing sports and music. It's about comparing loyalty to something you believe in. I just happened to use sports. It could be a job that you love that had some bad years. You seem like a pretty creative guy. I'm sure you could come up with some others on you own.

1. True. Though when it comes to BJ they already have changed the producer

2. Hmmm. You got something there. Though I do think that generally, even if rock stars have longer careers they necessarily dont have longer peaks. But enough of sports comparisons since it just doesn't work.

But anyway, I don't think you even can compare loyalty to music to something else. Most cases loyalty is based on so different things. Some things are for life, for example location based. Music, it's all about enjoying the damn thing. Not the looks, home town, nationality or so on. Its all about the tunes we can find our own in some way. Loving the music is what builds up the loyalty. Or did, actually. I don't see any loyalty in forcefully listening to things like, recent BJ album(s), which I really really dislike. As I don't see any point in doing so.

From my point of view, when it comes to music, it does show a lot of loyalty when people still bother talking about band like Bon Jovi even if they dislike past 10 years. Instead of forgetting all about the band, some of us enjoying the past not the present, still follow their career. What do you call that then?

What you don't get is that you don't have any facts. All you have are opinions you claim to be facts. You've yet to show me or tell me a single thing that could be regarded as a fact.

Good that you're having fun. Overstatements and lies? I seriously doubt your ability to understand written text.

A direct quote: I think that's pretty self-explanatory.

Again, direct quote: Again, there's only one way to understand that.

And I never said that you said so. What I said that you seem like a blind follower, because of what you post here and how you liken yourself to RDKopper.

Again, direct quotes from you:
Once again, it's pretty self-explanatory up there.

Because it wasn't. You really, REALLY don't know what irony means. That's ok, many people make the same mistake. You're not alone.

Anything I've quoted, I've quoted exactly as they were. No distorting anywhere. Anyone can look them up, and unless you've edited the posts (which BTW shows), the quotes are exactly as I've quoted them.

Why would I regret anything? Because you think you've "won"? You acted idiotically, it was pointed out to you and you just keep on doing it. The only thing I'd regret was that I clearly misjudged your ability to see what you do.

Oooh, big boys. Big boys who're too afraid to let people know how old they are must be REALLY big boys.

I've made my point for enough times and with enough of your quotes that even the thickest skull oughta be penetrated by know. You tried to tell others what a Bon Jovi fan can or can't listen and where they can or can't post. That's just stupid.

Ice

Depends on the player. Some are excellent in their 40s, some have to give up before 30.

In music, there are those that can do it well in their 50s and even 60s. Bon Jovi looks like one of those who should've given it up after 25 years. They can't play like they used to. No matter who the "manager" is.

Ice