But resolution of the "crisis" (a tad overly-dramatic, don't you think? But I know what you mean) just might not be do-able right now. Whatever the reasons that he's not there, maybe they can't just be solved anytime soon.
You say the absence is nothing to do with happiness etc - what do you think it's to do with? (I don't know, obviously, I'm just genuinely intrigued what you think it could be).

I agree that my preference too would be a BJ album with Richie. Absolutely!

I don't know shit, you're right.
The whole morality police point you raise is exactly what you said - why don't we leave all the drama, blame and hatred until we know more?
I can understand people being pissed off. I truly can. I was massively disappointed, annoyed and then angry for answers at the beginning. But the amount of time that's passed clearly would indicate it's some sort of big issue, or at least an issue that's important enough in the mind of whoever is key to making the decision.

Surely you must see that by jumping the gun and getting on Richie/Jon/whoever's back before we know anything is a tad unfair?

I'm not taking any sides here. I'm not defending Richie, or Jon. But I'm also not about to attack the guys who've made the most important and influential music I've listened to.

It also seems some folky are making themselves (and others) more worked up by getting angry about it. It's not helping, and it's not going to bring Richie back.

But as Jessy said, everyone deals with things differently.

And Crashed - man, I'm sure you are a good guy. This thread is awful for winding people up the wrong way.
But as I said, I'm not trying to defend anyone - if it turns out this is all over nothing, then give whoever both barrels.

You say "There's absolutely nothing to suggest Richie has blown off rhe tour for anything other than a personal whim" - so what do you think it's down to? Do you really think he'd just ditch a tour after 30 years on a whim?

I honestly don't know, that's what's frustrating - when all this started I thought it had to be serious - family, his health or as we discussed, his mental state - or that he just had a commitment to look after Ava.

But as time has gone on Richie hasn't done himself any favours - if it was any of the above we'd all have given a pass - but instead we've seen pictures of new cars, holidays with his daughter, shoots for his fashion line all whilst he should be on stage with the band who are absolutely working their asses off right now but no matter how hard they try the absence of Richie will affect the music and the atmosphere for us long term fans, there's no way it can't.

The only thing that still makes sense to me is looking after Ava, and I'd have no problem with him doing that, but at least he could have said sorry to the fans and not once has he.

Dude, I'm with you and hope there's a genuine reason behind it all.

But I don't think the things he does while not with BJ should be an issue - the guy has to do something with his time. Providing he didn't bail TO DO the fashion stuff etc, then I think there's not much to judge on.

But you're right - a sorry would've been nice.
However (you knew it was coming, didn't you?! LOL) - playing devil's advocate once again. Having worked in a media/legal capacity....sometimes you have to make sure you don't say sorry as it can legally imply responsibility.
And whether its his fault or not, he might have to be careful not to say that.
I know that's all a bit w@nky and sounds like shit, and in truth I find it unlikely, but just playing that Advocate.... ;)

No, no, no. I didn't say it wasn't happiness. I said there's nothing concrete to prove it. From what is out there, my gut is telling me its a mixture of two issues- Aftermath and Ava- but there is nothing definitive for me to hang my hat on. If it turns out to be about money, some whim, some totally ridiculous reason, I wouldn't be surprised.

My anger, as I've said before, is aimed at the handling, which in the face of nonsense tweeting and vague statements, I feel is becoming more and more justified. People have argued legalities and gagging orders- the tweets in particular seem to knock that on the head somewhat. Whatever his personal reasons turn out to be, anger at him for the handling of it is fairly legit.

I get your viewpoint. If I can summarise- these guys are still human beings who deserve their happiness and privacy? I wouldn't argue against that, but I do believe that with the position they're in, they have an added responsibility to their fans when in the middle of a commitment to them. His actions, for better or worse, are affecting his fans. No one expects him to appease every individual, but as an entity he should have addressed them properly by now. He could help himself and those fans by coming out and saying something coherent. How happy will he be if this carries on and he has no band or fans left?

What you're saying, about being patient, not judging etc: I'm not saying you're wrong to take that stance, I just think you're not giving enough credit to the guys on the other side. Constantly telling them to give Richie a break when in truth they've given him a break for long enough. Their patience is wearing thin though, and a certain level of anger is justified now.

It's quite creepy but interesting in a way how I constantly accidently come across very old and more recent interviews alike where somehow, someway the whole band-dynamic matter is addressed.

I've found this great Kerrang interview from 1986; "Slippery When Wet" had just been released. I like it so much that I'll probably end up posting the entire thing in the General section of this board, but there was a part that jumped at me and I thought it could be somewhat relevant to the topic at hand here, considering how one of the points we made (whether it has everything, little or nothing to do with Sambogate) is that Richie has been skipping an unknown amount of rehearsals for quite some time (plus the infamous Calgary show, when it all started) or also how another hit topic was Richie's involvement in both writing and demoing "What About Now", not to mention the whole CEO thing about Jon.


So anyway... In the article, the journalist was saying how positively impressed he was that David's input on "Slippery When Wet" seemed so much more significant compared to Bon Jovi's previous records. And then he quotes Jon:

"I'm really pleased that David has come through so well, because there was a point not so long ago when I had to threaten him with not playing on the LP at all! You see, Richie and I would spend ages in the rehearsal studio working on material and David would take the blasé attitude that, 'OK, I'm going home now'. His heart didn't seem to be into working as hard as us, which is why he only co-wrote one track on the new LP. So I just told him that unless he started to pull his weight I'd have to think about where he stood in this band. Fortunately, he took notice of what I said and pulled himself together magnificently.

People may find this strange, but I care about the musicians in this band. We've all worked together for so long that we're really good friends. In fact, we all live so close to each other that being in Bon Jovi is like being in a small community. And our attitudes are unchanged as well. For instance, I'm still a big music fan.[...]"

Long comments in long thead? I'm out. See you when Richie tweets something stupid again.

It may be a while, previously when he posted something stupid, he went silent for a few weeks before returning, so I think end of July is his likely twitter return :D

Can't we just make up a Richie tweet? Cos ya know some people will skip a few pages and think it's real. :D

How about:

Thnks for the bday wishes. Buy Aftermath of the Lowdown to bask in the glow of my soul.

Necessary spelling error included to make it more realistic. :lol:

Yeah he does. It's got the official tick next to it as well: https://mobile.twitter.com/JonBonJoviNJ