Is Jon's voice real on the post-2000 studio tracks?
 

Jon always seems to be in very good shape vocally in the studio (yes, even on "Burning Bridges"), but in concert he's just awful nowadays.

On the studio recordings his voice is always fresh, powerful (well, at least a lot stronger than live) and clear. The nasal sound is there sometimes, but it's not nearly as prominent (or annoying) as live. In the studio Jon even uses his good ol' rasp pretty often, but always dodges it completely on stage.

My question is this: how is it possible for Jon to sound great on every album, but not live? Is it auto tune, the possibility to record many takes of a song, that Jon always happens to have his "good days" while recording an album, his will to show off on the record, or all these things?

Well there are 2 theories on this forum, the one that says that Jon can't sing and he uses studio engineering to make his voice sound good and the one who says that he gives his best and does 100 takes on the song but also splits the parts, for example he sings "Take a look around yea the sky is falling, sinners say your prayers this train is off the tracks" and he keeps recording that part untill it sounds good and then he moves on the next part and repeats the process until he finishes.

I am somewhere in the middle :D I believe that he really gives his best and repeats the same part until it sounds great and he also uses some studio engineering to make his voice sound better.

I am 100% sure that his voice isn't pure studio magic because in my country there are "artists" who are very popular and sound perfect in the studio but live they don't even sound like the same person, they are so out of tune and their voices are very very different... they sound so different that you wouldn't even think that it's the same person singing. But when Jon sings you can clearly tell that it's him, for example on We Don't Run, he sings it like shit live but you can clearly tell that it's the same guy.

I hope you understand my point.

the part by part recording is the most probable theory. there is also a chance jon records a note below and then he makes each note higher that would make the quality a bit off though in that lvl and would sound somewhat robotic like in
i m with you. small parts can change overuse cant be hidden

Of course the studio tracks are doctored to a certain extent.

However, stuff like Autotune, Melodyne, reverb on the vocal etc. doesn't magically induce rasp to the vocals. He has infinite takes, can take time off, drink some hot tea, warm up, and do ONE SINGLE raspy line in the studio. Live, if he messes up a raspy line, he potentially damages his vocal chords for 3 seconds of live entertainment.

In the studio, those moments are documented forever. Going to his limits vocally pays off much more, so to say - it's there for more than just 3 seconds, but part of his legacy. And he doesn't have to go straight into the next line after a scream or raspy line, but instead, can take the rest of the day off (I'm exaggerating, but you know what I mean).

The above response really does sum it all up...

I'll just add in my 2 cents... If vocals were recorded like live albums then most new albums would only take 2 to 3 hours to record... Not weeks, months, or even years... Albums are made just like Movies where they collect a bunch of takes/tracks and literally copy and past them all together seamlessly. Let a little common sense prevail here but the more solid the artist, the quicker the vocals could be recorded... That's why the Blaze album was complete start to finish is a month... And the end result is a vocal masterpiece.

Of the choice of 2, it might be easier for an artist to start off in a higher key verses switching from lower to higher... Also wording could play a role in hitting certain notes too.. They could have an artist sing totally different lyrics or just gibberish to get to the note and then once that get it, delete everything else behind it...

If you ever listen to one of those vocal only tracks, they sounds much different with all the music stripped away. It's even possible to go back into the vault and pull out a vocal from a totally different song, paste it into a new song, overlap it with new music and you would never even know...

I remember a few years back there were talks of creating a new Elvis song. As long as they select lyrics in the right keys, it's like playing a piano...

There are also little thing like speed changes too. WDR

But did he damage his voice permanently during SWW era or what happened to his voice in general?

I mean he did awesome vocal performances on Blaze Of Glory and here:


he just delivers LIVE & is plain awesome singing-wise!

Could it be the age thing also?

He cant really sing old songs anymore but IMHO it seems there's also struggling with newer ones.

He can't perform like that anymore because of different factors like smoking, genetics that had changed his voice, age and also the abuse of his vocal chords during the SWW tour.

First of all, the Behind The Music makes it seem like Jon blew out a chord... Jon lost his voice (similar to Laryngitis) for a short period due to over usage and his doctors gave him steroid shots to get the swelling down... In a similar comparison, it's like an athlete suffering from a severe sprain verses a break or fracture.

They repaired Jon's voice and he was good as gold again but just like any other athlete, age starts to take it's toll. Your voice is like any muscle that endures damage... It's eventually going to catch up to you with age.

IMO, I think his voice is the way it is today, not from the SWW Tour, but because Jon continued to use the wrong technique for 15+ years after. That, in combination with other factors. His voice deepened with age (as it does with most people), smoking, etc...

Can you explain in which ways his technique is wrong and hurtful for him? Do you mean the rasp and the shouts?

There's a lot of studio trickery that everyone does. Doing a song line by line, over dubs etc but the first time it was ever NOTICEABLE as hell for me is What About Now. Ebbins and Patrick Leonard definitely captured his voice far more naturally and as it is but with Shanks it feels like it's blanketed or compressed or something.