Jons Voice again........
 

Has Jon himself ever talked publicly about how his voice has, shall we say "changed" to be polite, in interviews etc etc. :?:

In some interview around the time of the release of WAN he stated to a reporter that his voice had "mellowed out" over the years and how he changed his attempt from making the best possible record to making an album that he'd be able to sing live.

What a bizarre statement considering WAN has more vocal touch ups than any other. To the point where he changed the vocal melody of I'm With You live to be able to sing it. What a head shaker.

He made some statements about the high notes being a bitch to sing and Thank god the audience sings the chorus of Prayer. I also remember him saying something to the effect that "the day I can hit the notes is a good day". I'm paraphrasing of course, I remember those statements and him laughing while wearing a stupid pretentious scarf over a turtleneck....

This is the interview Javier is talking about, if anyone is interested.

I remember one video (was it on one of the DVD's?) where they discussed the keys of the older songs and he said, "nothing above G for me now", or something to that effect.

Ice

Back in 2009, Jon was being interviewed on BBC Radio 2 (whilst promoting The Circle) and the subject came up about why certain songs don't get played very often (if ever) and he flat out said it was simply because he can't hit the high notes anymore. And he laughed it off as he was saying it. I remember it because I couldn't believe how blatant he was. I'm all for honesty don't get me wrong, but as a fan, it's not good enough.

He seems to be addressing the (lack of) high notes, by what about the over-all shape of his voice in general? If I was the lead singer of a band like Bon Jovi, or Aerosmith, or Journey or whoever, and my vocals were that shot, I'd be quite concerned.

Well who says he's not? He's not giving interviews flat out saying "Yeah my voice is gone" but I'm sure he's realized the state of his voice by now hence the constant setlist.

Exactly. And if he did attempt those songs, everyone would be bitching about his voice (even more so than they already are) and telling him to hang up the boots.

I feel for the guy. To have a talent stripped away from you would be hard, especially being the lead singer of such a well known band. It's not like he chose to lose his vocal abilities (albeit smoking doesn't help).

really ? don't think I've seen/heard that

pretty sure he quit smoking. His vocal cords aren't 'shot' people. I know it sucks to listen to him struggling and whining but he's a remarkable singer with a remarkable voice. He's a better singer than he was 20 years ago, well, technically. Thing is, we don't want a singing coach onstage, we want the good ol' John Francis Bongiovi with long hair and earrings singing These Days like a rock god. It ain't gonna happen. He's probably the only one to blame for losing his old vocal abilities but what d'you wanna do now ? Blame the shit of out him ? Old(er) age has come to pass and even though he looks younger than a regular 52 year old, his voice shows signs of abuse. Not everyone can be like Macca or Bruce.

He could, however, perform certain songs in a different key (other than a half step down).

You can't really believe he's a better singer today than he was in 1994. I just...that has to be a trollbait remark right?

The I'm with Youuuuuuuu part after the chorus. He sings the high melody on the record and then gives himself the lower one live. I really like the lower one, it gives the song such a moodier feel.

Well, the way the recording sounds makes you wonder if he's only ever sung the low version and the high melody was constructed in the studio by using Melodyne or some other tool. Sounds way too artificial to me...

I actually agree with everything stated in that post. He actually sings the right way on a technical level but his range is shot and tone is limited.

Smoking is not a factor at all. It's years and years of vocal abuse combined with age. It finally caught up with him. It's like playing football with a damaged knee for 30 years and then expecting it to be perfect when you're 50

Smoking definitely played a big role in him losing his "original" voice as well. Yeah, age is a major factor, no doubt about that. But we all know from various interviews that were done during that era that he started smoking heavily on the set of The Leading Man - out of boredom! Sure he had been enjoying the occasional cigarette before, but it became a true addiction at that time. And you noticed it in 1996. Sure he still hit the high notes, but it became obvious how much thinner his voice had gotten in comparison to 1995. Age couldn't have done that in a few months - smoking did. Just listen to Always from Wembley or Pittsburgh and then search for a 1996 performance.

I also don't agree about his technique improving. It's just different. Since he had pretty much use of his full vocal range 20 years ago his way of approaching certain notes and songs wasn't the same - but he took a lot of vocal lessons back then and certainly had acquired a solid technique to master those long live shows. Keep in mind that the set 20 years ago contained a lot more songs that were vocally demanding than they do nowadays. As soon as he realized that he couldn't go for the notes anymore (around the HAND tour) he adapted a different singing style (by e.g. using his "fish mouth technique") to push the maximum out of what was left of his range. He had a good ride with it for about 3 years, but I think it demanded even more of his chords than before (since he seemed to be "pushing" the notes more and more) and killed the rest of what he had left vocally.

I don't know who Macca is but as far as Bruce goes, he does not have the same vocals that he once did either. His tone has changed and his songs were never as vocally demanding as Jons.

If Jon had more back songs like Sleep and Sat Night, we probably wouldn't be as hard on him as we are now.

I still think Jon has enough left in him for another 10 to 12 years.

We'll get more acoustic type of shows like the most recent fan club event.

Ever heard of the Beatles?

And yes, Springsteens voice has changed, but he can still sing everything he's ever recorded and sound good. And he can do over 4 hour gigs and sound great up until the end. And scream like he used to. Jon can't.

Huh? Saturday Night is one of the most demanding songs to sing that Bon Jovi play these days. Sleep also has pretty high notes for Jon's today-voice. It's right up there where he can pull it off on a good day, but he needs to concentrate.

Ice

Yes

Let's not get carried away. He doesn't do 4 hour gigs. He has but not regularly. He's a raspy singer so that's why he could still sing his songs. I've heard Jon do wonders to Bruce songs but did you ever hear Bruce sing a Jovi song? The few that's he tried were a complete mess. He can't even come close to hitting those notes. Bruce will play it off like he don't know the song but in reality, he's just using that as an excuse.

No Way! That song don't even compare to a Prayer, Always, Bad Name, etc on a vocal level. Not even close. If so, which parts?

Aloha !

No he isn't. He's got a total lack of technigue, probably because his range is gone, and he tries to hit the notes any way he can. Seeing them pull all those weird faces to cram out the notes to the verses of When We Were Beautiful is ridiculous. Just watch the credits of that beloved documentary of himself.

bonjovi90 is on the money;

What also doesn't help is him doing these tours and trying to cram in as many shows in 1 year as possible, which is very interesting on a financial level. If he'd just take more breaks in between shows, but more importantly, in between legs, he'd have kept his voice in a much better shape as well.

There's the 1 hour with total buzzkills at every start of the show to warm up his voice and play it safe, then there's the bunch of hits, and then there's the encore where he tries to give all he's got left. That goes on for a year, and then he's completely off. Apart from the few minutes before and after the show, there's no real warming up, and there's no real cooling down.

All of that, his smoking, the travelling to foreign countries, different temperatures, climates and his allergies have given us Jon Bon Jovi, the leadsinger who isn't much of a singer anymore in a band that isn't much of a band anymore.

Salaam Aleikum,
Sebastiaan

I will lose this argument every time and still stand by my reasoning. Jon Bon Jovi would still sound the same today regardless if he ever smoked or not.

When you have someone shooting steroids into your throat night after night, it will eventually catch up with you. The dude sang his heart out and would scream that signature scream of his even when he had no voice left in him. You have to be a real special person to sing as high as you did in your 20s as you do in your 40's and 50's.

Adele already had vocal surgery at 24. You think she'll be singing the same at 52?

Smoking didn't help Jon's voice but not the reason for Jon's current vocal state. No Way!

This actually shows how clueless you are.

Aloha !

Yeah, that and his other 2.671 posts. Hatseflats!

Salaam Aleikum,
Sebastiaan

2.671 are 1% of my posts so I'd say that plays into my favor you big dummy.

Ah Duh... I call someone out for making stupid posts and I make a stupid mistake calling them out. Typical Seb

Ever heard of Paul McCartney?

No, he regularly does 3,5 hours. And he has done gigs over 4 hours, I know, I was at one when he played way over 4 hours.

Jon's a raspy singer as well. And I've heard Bruce sing Bon Jovi songs, with Jon and Bruce sounded better than Jon. As to hitting the notes, like I said, Bruce can sing anything he's ever recorded as they were recorded, Jon can't. And Jon can't even sing the notes Bruce hits these days. Plus, Bruce is a good 10 years older than Jon.

Yes way! You're not a singer, I gather. It's not only about the high notes, it's about the spaces to breathe, how long you stay in a certain register, how long the notes are etc. Saturday's chorus is a bitch to sing, much harder than Prayer. And Bad Name is a breeze to sing, it's one of the easiest songs of the whole 80's catalog. Always has a pretty hard chorus, but Sat Nite is up there as well.

And it's got the high notes as well. Sat Nite's chorus goes
G# G# A G# F# E E - A A G# F# E E B F# G# F# E.
(Hey, man, I'm alive, I'm taking each day and night at a time)

Always is
E - B A G# G# F# E E b c# G# F#
(I will love you ba-by, al-ways)

and the "high part"
G# G# G# G# G# A G# B
(I'll be there till the stars don't shine)

G# G# A G# G# G# G# A G# B
(till the heavens burst and the words don't rhyme)

So, they're in the same key and they have same notes. The difference is that Always has more breathing space and it goes lower during the choruses as well, which relaxes the voice. Sat Nite goes into the high register and stays there for the whole chorus, with more high notes (B's in this case), which Jon doesn't even try to sing now.

So, yes, Sat Nite is one of the hardest songs to sing. At least if you sing it like it was recorded and performed in the 90's.

And smoking kills your voice. Fast. Another thing that damages your voice is drinking "hard" alcohol (over 20%), which dissolves the lining in your throat. If you sing after that, you cause damage to your vocal chords. Every time.

Also, many 40 or 50 year-olds can sing just as high as they could in their 20's. There are many in the music business as well. The probable reason of why Jon can't do it is the fact that he's not taking care of his voice, and that he didn't take care of it back in the day. If he took as good care of his voice as he does of his body, he could sing a lot better.

Yes, your voice changes (the timbre, the tone), but your range doesn't have to diminish, it can even grow wider. It's all in the technique and the care you give your voice.

Ice

Aloha !

You honestly expected him to get that? I'd be surprised if he's capable of saying the alphabet in the right order.

Salaam Aleikum,
Sebastiaan

Nope. But the next thing he would've demanded were the proof, so I saved myself some time. Also, someone else might've thought like him, but does understand music theory, so maybe I saved a little time there as well. I'm big on time saving.

Ice

You gotta love a couple of bullies.

Yes, a couple of bullies who brought nothing to this thread. Unlike you.

I suggest you go through my posts and your posts from the last few years. And think about who's the bully after that. Who's the one attacking every thread with nonsense, non-informative posts that are only meant to piss people off. Like my explanation of singing clearly was.

Ice

Never doubted your and Seb's input to this board at all, so get off your high horse. But that doesn't give you two reason to bully someone who (in my view) is as valuable and as knowledgeable as anyone. Its an opinion. And you two, right now, are acting like a couple of bullies.

A bully doesn't contribute. And rdkopper doesn't know music theory nor does he understand singing technique. Pointing that out is not bullying. If you want to be an asshole, you can interpret Seb's comment as bullying, but mine certainly isn't.

And I can post dozens of posts by you that are way worse. Practice what you preach.

Ice

Aloha !

Exactly. I am the main contributor on this board. I contribute knowledge, wisdom, jokes, pranks, I am pretty much the reason why Jovitalk still exists. Without me, this board is dead.

But then there's always assholes like Iceman trying to to talk themselves out of being called a bully, and quickly point their finger at me, again. But no, not this time. I stand up to bullying and won't take it! Shove that finger up your ass, Iceman!

Salaam Aleikum,
Sebastiaan

So, you do have a spine after all!

Should I put another one up there or just switch?

Ice

Really? And I had you down as the intelligent one out of the gruesome twosome.

So an MD and an assistant MD of a multi-million euro conglomerate who has majorly contributed to a business being successful - happen to belittle their staff on a regular business, call names and are disparaging on their staff because of an opinion - AREN'T bullies??!!

Wow. Ok.

Wow. We're talking about messageboards, right? Not bad bosses at your work. Though, now I know why you're so pissed off all the time. Kinda feel bad for you.

A bully ON A MESSAGEBOARD doesn't contribute. Does that help?

Ice

Aloha !

Well, tiny, you won't feel much of it anyway. Small hands and all of that.

http://i293.photobucket.com/albums/m...icforscale.jpg

Salaam Aleikum,
Sebastiaan

Yep, you got it in one Ice. Well done

:rolleyes:

Yay! Another thread ruined by Nickolai who, again, contributed nothing to it! Rejoice, people!

But seriously, glad you are happy. Hope that helps dealing with your boss tomorrow. Hugs!


Ice

He sounds and looks like such a jerk - I think he should get his feet back on the ground.

This whole I'm the boss shit is so damaging.