Thank You, Goodnight: The Bon Jovi Story, coming to Hulu

2005/2006 was when mistakes became more evident. He used to be such a tight guitar player locked into the rhythm section but, I assume, once he got hooked on pain pills, he'd play out of key, miss cues and overly rely on four or five of his signature licks. BUT in 2012 he looked the best he had in years and his playing was fine! So I can't honestly think his comments were about his playing from that era. There's too much proof stacked against that.

I hate being the one to say it, I don't think Jon's vocal problems is an apt comparison to Richie's playing. I don't think Jon wants to souind like that. Richie's playing got lazy. Those aren't really the same. What IS the same is if Jon is making the point that you can't go on stage unless you are able to play in which case neither of them should be up there.

Yeah, that exactly my point. All of that stuff was way before the split and before he went into rehab. That's why I don't buy the Richie couldn't play thing. He's using stuff from 6 or 7 years before, to justify it.

Yeah, that's fair enough. Even though the result is the same as a listener, the reasons for the decline in Jon is different. Although, if Richie's dip in quality is down to addictions and the after effects, that is also a medical problem and not a case of being lazy.

You're also correct about his playing pre-2005. He could still drive the song and lock in with Tico/Hugh. However, I was seeing things in his lead playing that were worrying a long time before that. It got worse over time, but I was seeing signs as early as 2000. Even back then when I had only been playing guitar 3 years I could spot mistakes. Nothing like the teeth pulling experience of his solos over the last 10 years, but still.

In fairness to him, he still had his monstrous tone up until around Aftermath, and his feel was still there too. His performances in 2011/2012 were much improved, but still a shadow of the guitarist he had become in the 90s. Edit to add, none of Richie's decline aside form the obvious period was bad enough for Jon to be claiming he couldn't play like it was an ongoing issue.

In the first leg of the 2013 tour, we were complaining about Jon looking like a statue, glued to the mic stand, and praising Richie. His playing was better than on previous tours, and was active on stage. I can't believe Jon is talking about this period.

Is he? We're deciding he is. That's not the same.

I think I agree! The point about Jon claiming he couldn't play during this era, I'm not confident he is. It's no secret Richie was a messa after he left. Its' also entirely possible this is why he wasn't let back in. You need to be able to play. I hope that's what he means, the way we're saying makes no sense (to us anyway)

I didn't see as many mistakes in the 2000-2002 but noticed he was underplaying, and the newer material called for that. What mistakes are we talking about, I want to go back and watch. I was too new a fan to notice.

I hope John Shanks is in the documentary, he's my favorite

Going out on a limb here, but hear me out.

After Richie came back from rehab (after the LH tour thing), I remember him or Jon basically saying something to the effect of that Jon got him sober. I remember people on here saying it was in bad taste for Jon to take credit for getting Richie sober.

If his playing had anything to do with Richie's second exit, Jon may have a) remembered the unplugged fiasco and b) taken Richie starting to slip off the wagon again rather personally.

Keep in mind that this all falls, timeline wise, into the peak of Jon's asshole years ("I am the CEO", "I am gonna buy a football team - drop your solo activities!"). He may have felt like a very benevolent CEO to even allow Richie to tour solo at all, and felt like him then showing up even slightly drunk was unacceptable.

Who knows. But IMO, Richie was far from the weak link during the WAN tour (when he was with them).

I interpret the "you gotta be able to play" as meaning you have to turn up for work and actually play, rather than as a slight on his playing style.

Yes, it doesn't have nothing to do to Richie's style to play.

It was more like "You have to be in good condition physical and psychological to be able to play on tour in the right way"




This is how i see that phrase...